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  1. athena69
  2. Batwoman.tv General
  3. Sunday, 07 June 2020
Now that we have official confirmtion that they are indeed writing Kate Kane out of the show and bringing in a completely new character to take on the mantle of Batwoman, I have a few thoughts on the change in character dynamics.

On the one hand, I appreciate that they are honoring Ruby's legacy by not recasting the character of Kate. And since Ruby left on apparently good terms, I hope they leave the story open for Kate to make a appearance or three in the future, and not just kill her off. I just hope they come up with a really good reason for Kate leaving and not something lame like, she couldn't handle that her father hates Batwoman - not something the Paragon of Courage would throw in the towel for.

With Kate out of the picture, I kind of see it less likely that Alice will become Red Alice - without the impetus of working along side her twin sister, does she have enough of a moral compass to make that transition on her own? Maybe if Kate disappears before she has her chance to exact her revenge, she'll go after whoever she thinks is responsible, and inadvertently become a hero? And it seems to me that Alice never considered Batwoman a threat. But with someone other than her sister wearing the batsuit, I can see the Batwoman/Alice dynamic becoming much more antagonistic this next season. Without Mouse, Alice is now completely on her own. And if she can't have her revenge on Kate (and no Kate to help draw out the good in her), I think she's going to become a lot more dangerous.

And then there's Safiyah. She's been gunning for Batwoman. And she's pissed at Alice for betraying her. So, the enemy of my enemy is my Bat-friend? Maybe Alice will have to team up with the new Batwoman to stop Safiyah?

What about the rest of the Bat-team? I don't see Luke being written out - he's the one with all the Bat-tech secrets. Altho, I do see his becoming Batwing happening sooner than later as a result of this change. Perhaps this will open it up to bring Parker in full time to take over Luke's duties in the bat-cave?

And since we absolutely cannot loose the Mary-Luke dynamic (which I think will become even more fun once Luke becomes Batwing), I think Mary will put herself in the role of big sister to "Ryan" and try to smooth out some of the rough edges that they've hinted at in the character description.

Jacob, of course, will continue down his dark obsession to kill Batwoman, and it's going to get him in trouble at some point. I can almost see him going rogue and bordering on becoming a villain. But I also see that without Kate, I think he'll be more of a thorn in the Bat-team's side and we'll see less of him in general.

It seems to me that Sophie's main purpose on the show was to create some sexual and emotional tension for Kate. With Kate gone, I don't know... maybe she'll be the only thing that keeps Jacob from completely dragging the Crows down the road to police state?

Julia is Alfred's daughter, so she'll always have a place in the Bat-family, and personally, I think she needs to be on the team permanently. But I have a feeling that she'll be an on-again-off-again character. Given her happy-go-lucky attitude, I think she'll get along great with "Ryan".

So, them's my thoughts. Anyone else?
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In my opinion one of many articles that start with a wrong assumption and have little to none imagination how the storyline may advance in a good way.
I've noticed a similar trend in all these "what could happen" type of articles. I have to wonder if any of these authors have actually watched the show, or even paid attention to the details as they did watch, cuz some of them have had flat-out wrong info about events in the show. And all of these articles are starting to have a "let's get more people to read our site with an attention grabbing headline" feel to them - all fluff and no substance.

As I've said before, I trust Caroline Dries and team to give us a great storyline. May not be exactly what we want, but based on what they gave us in season one, it'll be engaging and character-driven.
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Here is another article... nothing new, just a different source essentially saying that there is no Batwoman without Kate.

https://www.hypable.com/no-batwoman-kate-kane

#BatwomanisKateKane



Yeah, some valid points but I don't like the overall tone of the article.
And the article doesn't even consider the possibility that Kate might return to the show.
In my opinion one of many articles that start with a wrong assumption and have little to none imagination how the storyline may advance in a good way.
Well, I'm sure these and us will be surprised in a good way.
I may be repeating myself, but I would bet that Kate will return in the 2nd season!
http://www.maskripper.org
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[my Blog about masked women in movies, TV, cosplay and comics]
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Here is another article... nothing new, just a different source essentially saying that there is no Batwoman without Kate.

https://www.hypable.com/no-batwoman-kate-kane

#BatwomanisKateKane
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@Bratty_Brat

I really don't see why it has to be one or the other.

Recast Kate Kane and add the new character.

Fans hBe said overwhelmingly at various site that they want Kate recast. If producers still feel audiece may not accept the Ruby replacement, then add the backup character. If audiences don't like new Kate, then they can always write new Kate out and promote the new character to Batwoman later. Although, I don't see this as being necessary.

Rebranding the show Batwoman and _____ could give them the reboot they apparently want without alienating Kate Kane fans.

#SaveKateKane
#BatwomanisKateKane
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I just made a new page about season 2 on my Blog:
https://maskripper.org/new-batwoman-page-season-2-preview

On that page I wanna present the known facts, some of the rumors and my expectations towards season 2.
By the way: Just 214 days to go! ;)
http://www.maskripper.org
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[my Blog about masked women in movies, TV, cosplay and comics]
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I have faith that Caroline and team will come up with something that I will enjoy. But I won't know unless I watch.

Maybe, because I've never read the comics, I'm not as rooted in the concept of Kate Kane as Batwoman. Just to play devil's advocate here, this does open up their options because they don't [i]have
to follow the Kate Kane story lines. And frankly, based on what I've read about those stories, it sounded more like a soap opera, like the (male) writers maybe didn't quite know how to write for a lesbian lead.[/i]

They want their own original character, good for them, as long as they go and make their own original mantle and supporting characters for said hero - not steal Kate's for the branding and then take a huge-steamy-dump all over a much loved character in order to do it.
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Sorry to see you go, @Bratty_Bat, but I do understand your reasons.

Like most everyone else, I hate that they are replacing Kate vice recasting. Kate Kane represents Gay Pride in my mind, and it sucks that we're loosing that. We all watch TV for escapism, and for me, altho the plot holes drive me insane, one of the things I really love about the show is that it's character-driven. Granted we're loosing the best character dynamics of the show between Kate and Alice, but I have faith that Caroline and team will come up with something that I will enjoy. But I won't know unless I watch.

Maybe, because I've never read the comics, I'm not as rooted in the concept of Kate Kane as Batwoman. Just to play devil's advocate here, this does open up their options because they don't have to follow the Kate Kane story lines. And frankly, based on what I've read about those stories, it sounded more like a soap opera, like the (male) writers maybe didn't quite know how to write for a lesbian lead.

At any rate, I'm going to think of season 2 as a kind of reboot, and give it a chance.

Perhaps, if we think of Batwoman as the Dread Pirate Roberts? ;)
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IMO don't care about the placeholder name. I'm not excited about another member of the Batfamily using her mantle either (the writer said in the official statement that it's an OC anyway), they have their own, they should use their own.

When an adaption of a novel or comic series you love is disrespectful to the source material to the point that you cannot enjoy it, you do not watch or support it. What would be the point.

^ I really enjoyed the dicissions with you here... Bratty_bat
I can understand when someone is really unhappy about Kate being replaced....right now, I'm not happy about it too.
But you don't know (as the rest of us) at all how the show will go on, which storyline is behind all that.
So I think you shouldn't just quit the show and the whole Arrowverse.
To me that sounds like a big overreaction as if the producers offended you personally.
Even if your are not happy with Kate being gone....have some faith in them and watch at least the first episode of the season 2.
It also would be a real shame if you wouldn't be on the forum anymore, since you are one of the most active here.

It's not an overreaction to stop watching some TV shows if they aren't enjoyable, it's just how TV goes. And since this is a forum about the TV show, and I'd only really be around to discuss the comics. It would be redundant to stick around after I'm done with discussing season 1, and my disgust at the planned changes for season 2.

As a kid I loved season 1 of Dark Angel, my friends and I discussed it at school after every episode.
Season 2 had a complete tonal change and we hated it, we stopped discussing it, I hate-watched it once through and never again (shouldn't have it was awful and I know better now). I never bought it for my dvd collection like I did with season 1. For me the show ended after 1 season - seems Batwoman may go the same way.
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^ The name Ryan Wilder is not official yet, it can be a place holder for variety of bat family members.
The "big picture" behind all of this is totally unknown for us right now. As long as Kate Kane isn't killed she can return to the show. Or, at least a version of her from another earth! That wouldn't be a total surprise as well. Seemingly there isn't only earth prime left after the crossover.
http://www.maskripper.org
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[my Blog about masked women in movies, TV, cosplay and comics]
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Why should I give season 2 a chance if they won't give a recast a chance. I watch shows for enjoyment and escapism, not to see one of my favourite characters in fiction replaced with a random insert.

There are so many shows out there to watch, I have no need to waste my time on Imposter-Batwoman.

If they wanted to make their own original character they should make their own original hero name for that character, but they are using an existing brand name as a shortcut.
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^ I really enjoyed the dicissions with you here... Bratty_bat
I can understand when someone is really unhappy about Kate being replaced....right now, I'm not happy about it too.
But you don't know (as the rest of us) at all how the show will go on, which storyline is behind all that.
So I think you shouldn't just quit the show and the whole Arrowverse.
To me that sounds like a big overreaction as if the producers offended you personally.
Even if your are not happy with Kate being gone....have some faith in them and watch at least the first episode of the season 2.
It also would be a real shame if you wouldn't be on the forum anymore, since you are one of the most active here.
http://www.maskripper.org
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[my Blog about masked women in movies, TV, cosplay and comics]
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I won't be watching, in fact I'm dumping the Arrowverse as a whole.

I might give Titans a go - after all Nightwing is Dick Grayson there, not random-insert-replacement because reasons.

There is a petition going for those interested: https://www.change.org/p/the-cw-keep-kate-kane-as-batwoman

Unless there is a change (doubtful) and they simply recast Kate, I won't be around here much anymore, if at all. I'll be sticking to the Batwoman comics forums instead, as I said I would.

Well, season 1 was fun, and Kate's time on the screen was good while it lasted. Maybe one day we'll get an animated series or something with Kate Kane as Batwoman, but until then. Cheers.
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Right now we can only speculate like hell what will happen and that makes it a pretty.....UNCOOL situation right now.
Well, on the one hand, yeah, it does suck that we don't know what's going on, but info will be dribbling out as they get closer to filming. On the other hand, that's what THIS post is for - so we can speculate and bounce ideas, and maybe get a laugh and point back and see who hit the mark! ;)

But at least I now have found out who will be playing the new Batwoman
Did I miss a post?!? Who? Natalie Sharp? I'd be surprised if it was her since she already has an established character on Flash (appeared in 3 episodes this season) and still could potentially return.

@comic fan - Yeah, likewise, I hope they acknowledge Kate's death in Supergirl, somehow. Kate/Ruby and Kara/Melissa had a great chemistry together, it really sucks that we'll never get to see that friendship grow. It would be nice if they acknowledged it in all the Arrowverse shows - she was one of the Seven Paragons, after all (whoa! I just had an epiphany - seven paragons == seven samurai!) But I guess we'll have to wait until season 3 to see how they handle the World's Finest crossover. And how is this going to affect the crossover with Superman & Lois?!?

I really don't think Alice will be the one to kill Kate/Batwoman. Cuz if she did, even tho she still wants revenge against her father, I don't think Jacob is an important enough a character for Alice to hang around for - I mean, really, at this point, most of us would likely be rooting for Alice to succeed, right? As much as I think it would be in character for Alice to get Jacob to kill Batwoman, then Alice would have no reason to stay in Gotham, and she's too delicious a character for them to write her out, so likely, I think it'll be someone else. Hush, maybe?
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Twitter campaign for Kate Kane...

Batwoman Fans Launch "Kate Kane is Batwoman" Twitter Campaign

#SaveKateKane
#BatwomanisKateKane
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I'm very curous about how the other characters will be played off this new Batwoman.Losing Kate will have the most impact on Alice,Jacob and Mary the most I think.Luke and Julia are Batman legacy characters so I think they will fit more easily with a new Batwoman.Not sure how well Sophia will fit.

After seeing the Natalie Sharp audition Siggi found,it feels like Kate is going to be killed off.If that happens,hoe Kate dies will be a big impact.What if Jacob is responsible for Batwoman's death?What if it's Alice?

Also since I watch all the Arrowverse shows,I really want to see how this impacts other shows.Specifically Supergirl.The relationship between Kate and Kara is something special IMO.Plus they had plans to do more with the two characters pre-COVID 19 and Melissa's maternity leave.I can't see there being a new Batwoman and something happening to Kate and Kara not having a reaction or wanting to check out what's going on.

What I hope is that even if they can't do a crossover next season due to Supergirl starting later on in filming than the other shows,that they do some type of offscreen thing on Batwoman,Supergirl or both.

Sort of like what Buffy and Angel did in season 6 and season 3.Buffy died in the season 5 finale(Angel and his team were than informed in his season 2 finale with a small crossover from Buffy character,Willow) but than the show moved to UPN while Angel was staying on The WB.As a result,The WB refused to let the regular crossovers between the two shows continue(UPN was open to it and the crossovers returned the following year).As a result they dealt with Buffy's resurrection with a offscreen crossover.Angel receives the news that Buffy is alive with a phone call and Buffy learns that Angel knows she's back and they both rush off to see eachother..The following episodes on both shows have them returning to their respective team/family and we are only told that the reunion was intense.

I would have no problem due to the real life issues of filming for the 2020/2021 season if they do something like a phone call or implication of something happening offscreen regarding Supergirl/Kara,Kate's fate and learning of the new Batwoman.
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I agree with 99% you say athena69!
When they really remove Kate on a permanent basis all the family connections will crumble, and of course I don't like that.
Right now we can only speculate like hell what will happen and that makes it a pretty.....UNCOOL situation right now.
I HOPE for some infos really soon!
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But at least I now have found out who will be playing the new Batwoman ;) :o :D :D :D
I'm already obsessed by her! :D
http://www.maskripper.org
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[my Blog about masked women in movies, TV, cosplay and comics]
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I am still living in a state of denial and hoping they do "an about face" before filming resumes, as Vancouver is still closed for tv production work...

I totally agree that the Mary-Luke dynamic cannot be lost.

I too fear without Kate, the Red Alice story will not happen. We certainly won't get the sisters reunited as Batwoman/Red Alice.

Perhaps the new character can be Latin-x, LGBTQ or nonbinary.

Again, I am in denial and hope they are playing us and the new character will be Kate's new partner and not the new Batwoman.
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